HR 669 : CONGRESSIONAL HEARING BANNING NONNATIVE SPECIES APRIL 23, 2009 ACTION NEEDED
- Thread starter neoprodigy
- Start date
Wow, 18 pages and still no one knows what's going on. Pessimists saying it will be the end of the hobby. Optimists saying it will never pass. Apathists who don't care. Where do you fall?
We all know what the long term goal of the bill is. That is not difficult to figure out. They want to create a list of non native animals that will be allowed to be bought, sold, bred and traded (the approved list) and a list of animals that will not be allowed to be bought, sold, bred and traded (the unapproved, or banned if you will, list) In order to come up with each list the USFWS will look at each species individually and determine its potential to cause harm and place it on the appropriate list. All in all, this is not entirely a bad thing. I don't think anyone wants to see any part of the environment destroyed or any native species rendered extinct because of an invasive species.
For me, the biggest issue in this whole thing, and its an issue that no one has been able to address satisfactorily for me, is what really happens when the bill is passed. I mean in the short term. In the 24 months (the time specified in the bill itself as to when a temporary approved list must be submitted)
Some people who read the bill say that if the bill passes that means every single non native species (with the exception of the groups specified. see post #121) will automatically be banned and will remain banned until the USFWS can make a final determination as to which list it will be placed on. This is absolutely the worst case scenerio and it is this scenerio that will be the end of the hobby as we know it. For a period of two years no one will be able to buy, sell, trade, or move across state lines with any African cichlids, South American cichlids, Guppies Platies, rainbow fish etc etc. OK, now after two years the USFWS says 95% of those fish are OK and are onthe approved list. Who will still be around to sell them? No one. The hobby is dead, or at least barely hanging on and while most people have gone on to other things the hope of it reviving is slim.
Other people seem to think that the passage of the bill will not immediatly have much of an effect. Certain species may be placed on the unapproved list right away under the bill's "emergency provision" but the majority will still be allowed to be bought, sold and traded until such time (within the 24 months) they can be placed on the appropriate lists. If this is the case the the damage to the hobby will be far less extensive and since it is my belief that the majority of species probably as many as 90% or higher IMO, will be eventually placed on the approved list the hobby will not be affected as much.
The problem is, since we don't know, we have to treat it like it is the first scenerio. I've seen several posts on the reptile forums where people speaking with their representives are told that the bill won't effect pets or something along those lines. It seems that they don't even know.
Personally, I don't think the bill will be passed. It will probably get out of subcommittee and it might even make it out of committee but I doubt it will pass the full house. That doesn't mean I am sitting around doing nothing. I made about 20 phone calls today. I called my congressman, who isn't on the committee or subcommittee, to find out where he stands on the issue. His aide says he will get back to me. Understandably, he probably has very little idea as to what the bill even does right now. It's not his baby just yet. But, I figure if he comes back and says he is opposed to it I can focus my attention elsewhere.
Oh well, sorry about long winded post. Hopefully I made some sense. I'm sure if you are still reading you are one of those pessimists and for once I think pessimism is what is going to win the day for all of us. All I can say from here on out is that if worse comes to worse and you didn't make a phone call or you didn't write a letter or at the very least you didn't send an email then you can't very well blame those idiots in Washington. You have to be heard and you can't wait for someone else to do it for you. Even if you don't think the bill will pass, make the call, send the letter or send the email.
We all know what the long term goal of the bill is. That is not difficult to figure out. They want to create a list of non native animals that will be allowed to be bought, sold, bred and traded (the approved list) and a list of animals that will not be allowed to be bought, sold, bred and traded (the unapproved, or banned if you will, list) In order to come up with each list the USFWS will look at each species individually and determine its potential to cause harm and place it on the appropriate list. All in all, this is not entirely a bad thing. I don't think anyone wants to see any part of the environment destroyed or any native species rendered extinct because of an invasive species.
For me, the biggest issue in this whole thing, and its an issue that no one has been able to address satisfactorily for me, is what really happens when the bill is passed. I mean in the short term. In the 24 months (the time specified in the bill itself as to when a temporary approved list must be submitted)
Some people who read the bill say that if the bill passes that means every single non native species (with the exception of the groups specified. see post #121) will automatically be banned and will remain banned until the USFWS can make a final determination as to which list it will be placed on. This is absolutely the worst case scenerio and it is this scenerio that will be the end of the hobby as we know it. For a period of two years no one will be able to buy, sell, trade, or move across state lines with any African cichlids, South American cichlids, Guppies Platies, rainbow fish etc etc. OK, now after two years the USFWS says 95% of those fish are OK and are onthe approved list. Who will still be around to sell them? No one. The hobby is dead, or at least barely hanging on and while most people have gone on to other things the hope of it reviving is slim.
Other people seem to think that the passage of the bill will not immediatly have much of an effect. Certain species may be placed on the unapproved list right away under the bill's "emergency provision" but the majority will still be allowed to be bought, sold and traded until such time (within the 24 months) they can be placed on the appropriate lists. If this is the case the the damage to the hobby will be far less extensive and since it is my belief that the majority of species probably as many as 90% or higher IMO, will be eventually placed on the approved list the hobby will not be affected as much.
The problem is, since we don't know, we have to treat it like it is the first scenerio. I've seen several posts on the reptile forums where people speaking with their representives are told that the bill won't effect pets or something along those lines. It seems that they don't even know.
Personally, I don't think the bill will be passed. It will probably get out of subcommittee and it might even make it out of committee but I doubt it will pass the full house. That doesn't mean I am sitting around doing nothing. I made about 20 phone calls today. I called my congressman, who isn't on the committee or subcommittee, to find out where he stands on the issue. His aide says he will get back to me. Understandably, he probably has very little idea as to what the bill even does right now. It's not his baby just yet. But, I figure if he comes back and says he is opposed to it I can focus my attention elsewhere.
Oh well, sorry about long winded post. Hopefully I made some sense. I'm sure if you are still reading you are one of those pessimists and for once I think pessimism is what is going to win the day for all of us. All I can say from here on out is that if worse comes to worse and you didn't make a phone call or you didn't write a letter or at the very least you didn't send an email then you can't very well blame those idiots in Washington. You have to be heard and you can't wait for someone else to do it for you. Even if you don't think the bill will pass, make the call, send the letter or send the email.
Watch the webcast NOW.....
http://resourcescommittee.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=273&Itemid
Subcommittee on Insular Affairs, Oceans and Wildlife Legislative Hearing on H.R. 669 (10:00 AM -- 1324 Longworth)
LIVE VIDEO WEBCAST
LIVE AUDIO WEBCAST
http://resourcescommittee.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=273&Itemid
Subcommittee on Insular Affairs, Oceans and Wildlife Legislative Hearing on H.R. 669 (10:00 AM -- 1324 Longworth)
LIVE VIDEO WEBCAST
LIVE AUDIO WEBCAST
I am stunned at how disconnected from reality the people who oppose the bill are in the webcast. The industry still does not "get" it. Seeing the people at the top who oppose this bill have firmly placed me in favor of this bill. They have no interest in changing anything to protect natural waters or wildlife.
It's clear if this bill fails...it will be business as usual which will almost certainly assure passage of a similar bill. If aquaculture and the pet industry does not become proactive in protecting native wildlife, they will pass something.
It's clear if this bill fails...it will be business as usual which will almost certainly assure passage of a similar bill. If aquaculture and the pet industry does not become proactive in protecting native wildlife, they will pass something.
hmmm....43 billion total annual pet industry income which a large part is dog and cat food. Since dogs and cats are excluded from the bill and it's estimated we spend 100 billion a year to control invasive species, I suspect this bill might pass on economics alone.
Did you see the good ole' boy Tilapia farmer indicate that even if Tilapia escape, people can eat them so it's not all bad?
This is the guy they chose to represent the industry?
Did you see the good ole' boy Tilapia farmer indicate that even if Tilapia escape, people can eat them so it's not all bad?
This is the guy they chose to represent the industry?
